HELP: Family thinks DH is gambling addict - am I wrong?

SupportiveSpousalForum.net - Username: LostInTranslation Posted: January 15, 2001 | 11:47 PM

First time posting. Don't know where else to turn.

My husband Michael thinks he's the next Warren Buffett. My family thinks he's a gambling addict. I'm caught in the middle, watching our savings disappear into companies I've never heard of.

It started small - a few hundred here and there. "Just testing the waters," he said. Now it's thousands. Amazon, Google, something called PayPal. Names that sound made-up.

The worst part? He talks to me like I'm stupid for not seeing his "vision." Yesterday he actually said, "Lisa, you're thinking small. These aren't investments, they're revolution."

Revolution. With our mortgage money.

My sister says I need to freeze our accounts. My mom wants an intervention. Part of me thinks they're right.

But another part remembers the Michael I married - brilliant, passionate, usually right about things. What if this time he's not?

Has anyone else lived with someone who's convinced they can predict the future?

Re: Don't know where else to turn Posted by: BeenThereDoneThat | January 16, 2001 | 7:15 AM

Honey, the "brilliant and passionate" ones are the most dangerous. They can rationalize anything.

My ex used to say the same things - "vision," "revolution," "thinking big." Turned out he was just addicted to the rush of risking everything.

The condescending attitude is classic. Making you feel small for being cautious. That's manipulation, pure and simple.

How much has he lost so far?

SupportiveSpousalForum.net - Username: LostInTranslation Posted: January 18, 2001 | 8:30 PM

@BeenThereDoneThat - That's the thing. He hasn't really "lost" anything yet. On paper, anyway.

But we did have our worst fight ever last night.

I found out he put $8,000 into something called Pets.com without telling me. Eight thousand dollars for a company that delivers dog food via website. When I confronted him, he just shrugged.

"It's a growing market, Lisa. Pet owners will pay for convenience."

"We don't even have a pet!" I screamed.

He got that look - the one where I can see him deciding I just don't understand big picture thinking. "That's not the point," he said. "I'm investing in changing consumer behavior."

I told him we needed to see a counselor. He said fine, but only if they "understand technology markets." Like our marriage is some kind of venture capital deal.

Sometimes I feel like I'm married to a stranger who speaks in business buzzwords.

Re: We don't even have a pet! Posted by: TrustYourGut | January 19, 2001 | 6:45 AM

LostInTranslation - The contempt is what worries me most. Partners who respect each other don't make unilateral decisions about thousands of dollars.

And honestly? A website that delivers dog food? Come on.

He's lost touch with reality. The question is whether you're going to enable it or protect yourself.

SupportiveSpousalForum.net - Username: LostInTranslation Posted: February 5, 2001 | 10:15 PM

Everything is falling apart.

Pets.com went bankrupt. Eight thousand dollars, gone. Michael barely reacted.

"Early stage investing is about portfolio theory," he said, like he was explaining math to a child. "You expect some failures."

Some failures. EIGHT THOUSAND DOLLARS.

But here's what's messing with my head - his Amazon investment has tripled. His Google stock is up 60%. Even that PayPal thing is growing.

When I point this out to my family, they say I'm missing the forest for the trees. "He's gambling with your future," my dad said. "Eventually his luck runs out."

Maybe they're right. Maybe I'm just enabling him because some of his crazy bets are paying off.

Dr. Peterson (our counselor) thinks Michael has "grandiose thinking patterns." She wants him to attend GA meetings.

Michael refused. "I'm not sitting in a circle with people who lost their kids' college funds playing blackjack. I research emerging technologies."

The arrogance is stunning. But... is he wrong?

Re: Eight thousand dollars, gone Posted by: VoiceOfExperience | February 6, 2001 | 7:30 AM

LostInTranslation - This is exactly how it starts. Small wins that justify bigger risks. Classic addiction escalation.

The fact that he's dismissive of counseling and support groups? Huge red flag. Addicts always think they're different, smarter, more special than everyone else.

Your husband isn't researching. He's rationalizing.

SupportiveSpousalForum.net - Username: LostInTranslation Posted: February 20, 2001 | 9:45 PM

Michael invested $15,000 in something called Webvan today. Without asking me.

Fifteen. Thousand. Dollars.

"They're revolutionizing grocery delivery," he said when I found the withdrawal. "Imagine never having to shop for food again."

I completely lost it. Screamed about trust, about partnership, about basic respect. He just stood there with this patient expression, like he was waiting for my "emotional response" to end so we could discuss "fundamentals."

"Lisa," he said finally, "I know this is scary. But we're going to be rich. You just have to trust me."

Trust him. With what evidence? One successful stock pick doesn't make him Warren Buffett.

I called my sister crying. She's driving down this weekend. She thinks we need to separate our finances immediately.

Maybe she's right. Maybe I've been naive, thinking love and good intentions are enough.

I don't recognize the man I married anymore.

Re: Fifteen thousand dollars Posted by: ColdHardTruth | February 21, 2001 | 8:15 AM

LostInTranslation - He's not asking your permission because he knows you'd say no. That's not partnership, that's dictatorship.

The grocery delivery thing sounds insane. How much does it cost to deliver a gallon of milk? The economics make no sense.

Your sister's right. Separate finances NOW. Before he bankrupts you both.

SupportiveSpousalForum.net - Username: LostInTranslation Posted: March 15, 2001 | 11:30 PM

Webvan collapsed. Fifteen thousand dollars, gone.

Michael's response? "The timing was off. The concept was sound."

The concept was sound. We just lost our vacation fund and he's analyzing market timing.

But here's what's making me crazy - his PayPal investment just got acquired by eBay. For massive money. His Google investment keeps growing. Amazon is becoming this retail giant.

My sister came for the weekend like she promised. She looked at our portfolio and said, "Lisa, I don't understand any of this. But you've lost $23,000 on crazy websites and made $40,000 on other crazy websites. What does that even mean?"

I don't know what it means.

Dr. Peterson says the wins are making Michael's "disorder" worse. That success feeds grandiosity. But Michael won't go to sessions anymore. Says she "doesn't understand innovation cycles."

We're sleeping in separate bedrooms now. Not because I don't love him, but because I don't trust him.

How do you stay married to someone who lives in a completely different reality?

Re: What does that even mean? Posted by: SometimesRight | March 16, 2001 | 6:45 AM

LostInTranslation - I've been following your posts, and I have to ask something that might sound crazy:

What if your husband isn't gambling? What if he's just really bad at explaining what he sees?

My ex was brilliant with technology but terrible at communication. He'd make these leaps that seemed insane until years later when everyone else caught up.

I'm not saying your husband is right. I'm just saying... some of his "crazy" bets are paying off. Maybe the problem isn't his judgment. Maybe it's how he treats you when you don't understand.

SupportiveSpousalForum.net - Username: LostInTranslation Posted: April 2, 2001 | 7:20 PM

@SometimesRight - I've been thinking about your comment for weeks.

Michael and I had what Dr. Peterson would call a "breakthrough" last Thursday. Not in therapy - she fired us after Michael challenged her credentials during a session about "addiction denial."

No, this happened at home. Over Chinese takeout.

I was crying again about the money, about feeling shut out of decisions, about not understanding his world. Instead of getting defensive, Michael just... stopped. Put down his chopsticks and really looked at me.

"I'm scared too," he said quietly.

That caught me off guard. "Scared of what?"

"That I'm wrong. That I'm destroying our future instead of building it. That everyone else can see something I can't see."

We talked until 3 AM. Really talked. He admitted the condescension, the unilateral decisions, the way he treats my concerns like obstacles instead of valid fears.

"I get so excited about possibilities," he said. "But I forget that you can't see what I see. And I'm terrible at explaining it without sounding like a know-it-all."

For the first time in months, I felt like I was talking to my husband instead of some arrogant investor.

Re: Really talked Posted by: BeenThereDoneThat | April 3, 2001 | 7:30 AM

LostInTranslation - I'm glad you had a good conversation, but addicts are masters at emotional manipulation. They pull you back in right when you're ready to leave.

Has he actually changed his behavior? Or just promised to change?

Watch what he does, not what he says.

SupportiveSpousalForum.net - Username: LostInTranslation Posted: April 20, 2001 | 8:45 PM

@BeenThereDoneThat - Fair question. Here's what's changed:

Michael created a shared spreadsheet showing every investment, every gain, every loss. We review it together weekly. No more surprises.

He set up an "experimental fund" - money we can afford to lose completely. Everything else goes to savings, mortgage, boring stuff. If the experimental fund runs out, he stops investing until we rebuild it.

Most importantly, he explains his thinking now. Not in condescending business-speak, but in human terms. Why he believes in these companies. What problems they're solving.

It's actually fascinating. I never understood why people would buy books online until he showed me Amazon's customer reviews. Why would anyone send money electronically until he explained PayPal's fraud protection.

I'm starting to see the patterns he sees. Not because I'm becoming a tech expert, but because he's becoming a better teacher.

My family still thinks I'm making a mistake. But for the first time in months, Michael and I feel like partners instead of adversaries.

SupportiveSpousalForum.net - Username: LostInTranslation Posted: May 18, 2001 | 10:15 PM

Update: Michael wants to invest in something called Netflix.

"They mail DVDs to people instead of making them go to Blockbuster," he explained.

My first reaction was "that sounds stupid." But then I thought about it. How many times have we driven to Blockbuster only to find the movie we want is checked out?

We researched it together. Looked at their business model, their customer acquisition strategy, their technology platform. Michael walked me through the analysis like a patient teacher instead of an impatient genius.

"What do you think?" he asked.

I surprised myself: "I think people hate driving to video stores. And I think this Reed guy seems smart."

We invested $5,000. Together. From the experimental fund.

My sister thinks we've both lost our minds now. But honestly? It feels good to be building something together instead of fighting about it.

Re: Netflix Posted by: StillSkeptical | May 19, 2001 | 6:30 AM

LostInTranslation - I have to admit, your husband's track record is... unusual for someone with a gambling problem.

But mailing DVDs? Who wants to wait three days for a movie?

I hope you're right about this one.

SupportiveSpousalForum.net - Username: LostInTranslation Posted: June 8, 2001 | 9:30 PM

My family staged an intervention today.

Eight people in our living room: parents, siblings, best friends, even Michael's brother. All united in their concern about our "unhealthy financial decisions."

My mom cried. My sister read from a script about enabling addictive behavior. Michael's brother talked about "reality checks" and "responsible adulthood."

Michael listened quietly, then pulled out his laptop.

"I understand your concerns," he said. "Let me show you our actual financial situation."

He went through everything: the losses (Pets.com, Webvan), the gains (Amazon, Google, PayPal), the current portfolio value. Net result: we're up 180% in eighteen months.

The room got very quiet.

"We lost money on failures," Michael said. "But we made more money on successes. That's how portfolio investing works."

My dad wasn't convinced. "You're just lucky. This internet bubble will burst."

"Maybe," Michael said. "But we're not investing in a bubble. We're investing in companies that solve real problems for real people."

After everyone left, I realized something: I wasn't embarrassed by Michael's response. I was proud of it.

For the first time in this whole ordeal, we felt like a team.

SupportiveSpousalForum.net - Username: LostInTranslation Posted: July 4, 2001 | 7:45 PM

Netflix is exploding. Our $5,000 investment is worth $12,000.

More importantly, Michael was right about something I couldn't see: people don't just want convenience. They want choice. Blockbuster has maybe 200 movies in stock. Netflix has 15,000.

I'm starting to understand what Michael means about "seeing patterns." Not just in stock prices, but in human behavior. What people want vs. what they're willing to settle for.

My family still thinks we're crazy. But we're crazy together now.

Michael showed me this new company called Tesla yesterday. They want to make electric cars that don't suck.

"Cars that run on electricity instead of gas," he said. "Imagine no more gas stations, no more oil changes, no more emissions."

Two years ago, I would have laughed. Now I ask, "How much should we invest?"

Re: Crazy together Posted by: SometimesRight | July 5, 2001 | 8:15 AM

LostInTranslation - I've been rooting for you two this whole time. It sounds like you've figured out how to be partners instead of adversaries.

That's the real victory here. Not the money (though congratulations), but the teamwork.

Some people can see around corners. The trick is learning to communicate what they see without being condescending about it.

Sounds like Michael figured that out. And you figured out how to listen with an open mind instead of a defensive heart.

SupportiveSpousalForum.net - Username: LostInTranslation Posted: September 15, 2001 | 8:20 PM

Everything changed this week.

I'm not talking about our investments (though Google's about to IPO and our position is worth more than our house).

I'm talking about perspective.

Watching those towers fall, thinking about all the things that suddenly don't matter... it puts everything in context.

Michael came home Tuesday night and just held me. "We've been fighting about money," he said. "None of this matters if we're not together."

He's right. The investments, the family drama, the forum arguments - it's all noise.

The signal is simple: do you trust the person you married?

I do. Even when he's wrong (Pets.com, Webvan), even when he's arrogant, even when he explains things like I'm five years old.

Because when it matters - really matters - he's the person I want facing uncertainty with me.

SupportiveSpousalForum.net - Username: LostInTranslation Posted: December 20, 2001 | 10:30 PM

Final update:

Michael's Google position IPO'd. We're buying the house we've been dreaming about.

But more importantly, we've learned to communicate. Not just about money, but about everything. Our fears, our dreams, our different ways of seeing the world.

Michael still invests in companies that sound crazy. But now he includes me in the process. We research together, debate together, win and lose together.

My family has come around, mostly. Success tends to validate past decisions. Though my sister still calls Michael's Tesla investment "environmental virtue signaling."

We'll see.

To anyone reading this who's dealing with something similar: the question isn't whether your partner is right about their vision. The question is whether they respect you enough to help you understand it.

Michael wasn't gambling with our future. He was building it. But he was building it alone, which made it feel like gambling to me.

Now we build together. That makes all the difference.

Private Message - Three Years Later From: LostInTranslation | To: SometimesRight Date: January 15, 2005

Hi - I know it's been years, but I wanted to thank you for your support during the worst period of my marriage.

Michael's Tesla investment has been... interesting. The company almost went bankrupt twice, but they just released this electric car that's getting incredible reviews.

More importantly, we survived the dot-com crash. Lost money on some positions, made money on others. But we navigated it together.

Last month Michael showed me this new social networking site called Facebook. "It's going to connect everyone," he said.

I asked how much we should invest.

Some things never change. But now that feels like a strength instead of a weakness.

Thanks for believing in us when we couldn't believe in ourselves.

Lisa

P.S. - We had a daughter last year. Her name is Hope. Michael says she's going to grow up in a world where electric cars are normal and everyone is connected by computer networks. I believe him.